Hey folks,

I have been getting really into slalom paddling (picked up a DragoRossi SL350 and am really LOVING it) and was wondering if anyone out there has any recommendations for a paddle and particularly a paddle length. Right now am using my trusty Aquabound Shred (190 cm); it works fine but as I paddle with it I get the feeling there is something more fine-tuned for slalom boats out there. I picked up a 200cm AB Splat and tried it; it works OK but seems a little long for a boat this size (though I could just be needing to get used to it--it may be good for longer distance paddling). I dunno.

Any help would be appreciated. *If you have a chance to pick up one of the DragoRossi SL350's you really should. Boats are great quality, they are really affordable, Scott with DR is really nice to deal with, slalom boats streak across the water (they are so cool), AND this kind of paddling will snap your butt into shape in no time (which will help any other kind of paddling you are into I am finding).

Thanks again guys.

www.galasportusa.com/commerce/index.php?cPath=35_39

Another great piece of help, CJCC! Dang--you know the places on the web for us! But...now in addition to a paddle I see another boat I want. Damn. Thanks alot, CJCC (wife would kill me)!

I just googled "slalom kayak paddle", but you're welcome.

Well, this is the kind of crap I get when I google that:

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Whitewater slalom - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Mar 10, 2009 ... The other Olympic canoeing discipline is canoe/kayak flatwater. .... Since then, slalom paddling has been a regular at the Olympics. ...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slalom_canoeing - 35k - Cached - Similar pages
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slalom kayak for sale
Canoeing or kayaking (paddling) can be physically demanding and/or dangerous. ... For sale: 4 meter slalom boat, Dagger preditor, great shape, ...
www.monocacyboard.org/mboard/msg/167.html - 7k - Cached - Similar pages
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K-1 Slalom Olympic Canoe/Kayak Action Image
Laura Blakeman of Great Britain competes in the K-1 Slalom Event.
paddling.about.com/od/photosvideos/ig/Olympic-Canoe-Kayak-Images/K-1-Slalom-Through-Gates.htm - 16k - Cached - Similar pages
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Slalom kayaks
Slalom kayaks are just a form of whitewater racing kayak. ... Different kayak paddle blades will have different effects on the control you have over your ...
www.kayakhelp.com/types-of-kayaks/slalom-kayaks.php - 17k - Cached - Similar pages
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Slalom Scholarships for the New River Academy, The Academy of Huge ...
Entries should be about a slalom kayak experience incorporating the ... By entering to win a free kayak paddle you will receive our free catalog full of ...
www.kayakschool.org/slalom_scholarships.html - 16k - Cached - Similar pages

I'm actually still looking for any suggestions--those Galasports paddles are $340!

Like I always say, you pay peanuts, you get monkeys. Money spent on a good paddle is money very well spent, in my opinion... Double Dutch make slalom paddles:

www.doubledutch.eu/

"Like I always say, you pay peanuts, you get monkeys."

That's a funny saying! I like that one!

I'm used to spending $200 on a paddle, so I don't buy like--aluminum; but you're definitely right. The $200 AB's I've bought aren't working. Those Double Dutch's look like fine instruments to be sure. Now I have 2 really good resources for slalom paddles and high end slalom kayaks. Really do appreciate that.

I wonder what the preferred length is for a slalom paddle. I notice that there doesn't seem to be a lot of variation in boat sizes (essentially 2 or maybe 3), so there is no doubt a body type that just wouldn't slalom (maybe really tall or higher weight guys). So there probably are just a paddle lengths that work best. It's a tough decision. Any thoughts?

wow. Those Double Dutch boats are really nice too.

First off, I've never paddled a slalom boat. So, bearing that in mind, here is my two cents

I'm 6' and most people would consider me a powerful/athletic build I reckon. I creek/river run with a 197cm paddle 30 degree. I play/surf kayak with 194cm/30 degree. Although lately I've been doing everything with my 197 as the 194 is in two pieces - water inside of it, again I like large blades. But this information is probably 100% useless to you as it comes downs to personal preference. Corran like short paddles with large blades, other paddlers like longer paddles with smaller blades. So you've got to use what FEELS right to YOU. As a guess, I'd say that if you're around 6' tall you wouldn't want to go anywhere shorter than 195cm.

I'll forward this link to a mate of mine that slalom paddles (and WW too). Maybe he can shed more light as I know almost nothing about slalom

Very cool and thanks so much! I'm 5 feet 11 inches, weighing in at 144 lbs. zero body fat and like yourself an athletic cut but more along the lines of a swimmer's body. So the Shred I've used at 72 " (so I guess that would be, what, 180.34 cm--shorter than I thought it was in metric) has been the closest thing that's worked.

But lots of questions I am trying to get answered. Not expecting everyone to tell me everything--there just aren't any slalom paddlers around here where I live in Florida that I've found so far and NO place that sells the gear (so no try before you buy options). It's such a precise form of paddling that I can't help but believe that a fine-tuned paddle/boat/paddler combination is especially critical.

Here's a neat website from the BCU library that shows videos of the precise slalom techniques.


www.slalomtechnique.co.uk/view-k1technique.php?skill=2


It really is a very neat type of kayaking and I am really enjoying exploring yet another aspect of the sport.

Double Dutch's slalom paddle shafts are 115 cm., and each blade is around 47.5 cm. on average, which should make a paddle that's around 210 cm., so about 1 foot longer than your current paddle. I doubt that there are many whitewater shops in FL, but you might be able to go to a surf kayaking shop and check some out (I don't know how popular surf kayaking is there, though).

cjcc wrote:

Double Dutch's slalom paddle shafts are 115 cm., and each blade is around 47.5 cm. on average, which should make a paddle that's around 210 cm., so about 1 foot longer than your current paddle. I doubt that there are many whitewater shops in FL, but you might be able to go to a surf kayaking shop and check some out (I don't know how popular surf kayaking is there, though).

Like all composite paddles it is really easy to chop a shaft down (or, if you want to, lengthen it a bit, but you need some extra shaft material for that). All DD paddles can be ordered to your specific lengths and feathers etc.

As there are no shops near you it will pay off to learn how to repair/modify your own gear. You'll need it and it is fun too (and not too difiicult. Most DIY shops sell what you need for basic repairs).

DD has a habit of assembling paddles that cannot be altered in any way. Which is nice because they stay that way (as they should) but also cannot be altered (especially feather etc.) if you want to.

If I were you I would simply buy one or two sets of blades and a few shafts, probably from a shop in Canada or (if all else fails) the UK as these are generally a lot cheaper than the rest of Europe. Better still, try to get in touch with slalom paddlers and see if they can help you out. Visit the c-1 forum (www.cboats.net/cforum) because c-boaters are more used to DIY jobs (their gear is harder to get and needs more tweaking) and know where to get their materials.

BTW: one thing I really do not like about DD paddles is their shafts. Too big and slippery for my taste. But this is purely a personal preference so don't let that hold you back.

Another brand of really high end paddles is Lettmann. Way better and sturdier than Double Dutch, even the top paddlers in Holland (where Double Dutch is located) actually paddle Lettmann. www.lettmannkayaks.com/index.php/cPath/23_50 .

If you want to get a Lettmann, try to get in touch with flatwater sprint paddlers that go to Europe (such as Duisburg, a famous racing track for kayaks and canoes) and have them bring a paddle along. Lettmann is also very big in the wing paddle scene and they are bound to have some reps with every major international race/championship. That way you can save a lot on postage and customs

Just to clearify things, I am not associated with any paddle brand mentioned here, I own and use a DD freestyle kinetic paddle but that is about it.

Hope this helps, Cheers,

Michiel

Yo,

I practice slalom since a long time and I can help you.

The paddle size is 196-198, and the angle is 30-75.
There isn't "rules" about angle.

My advice, you have to take a small blade size to paddle hard and not have some shoulders or elbow problem.

Personally I paddle with a 196cm 30° for slalom and creekboating.

The best slalom paddle (for me) is the Lettmann Ergonom without aluminium insertion in the blade.
The aluminium insertions pull out sometimes...

You can try the Gpower paddles, size M, gpower.itm-system.com/
It looks like a lettmann

There's CRC Shiva www.crc-competition.com/index.php?Affich...&Nsc=2&No=2-1-29-32-
This one is a little bit fragile.

And after you have the Double Dutch paddles (fragile), the Galasport, and others...

by

Val
valgrollemund.blogspot.com

That's excellent information, Val! Thanks so much. Now I know my Shred has been close to the right size but I get why the narrower blade of the Splat seemed good (though the shaft is too long). I will be getting whatever 196cm paddle with a 30 degree feather. Am looking over all the websites now and will get going on purchasing one pretty quick here.

Val -- Question: How far (distance) do you slalom paddle? Just trying to understand some things. I get the maneuvering around gates, tricks, speed sprinting and am currently working on boat control. And I am sure I will find this all out myself in time. But, for example, I often paddle for distance and endurance conditioning. I've been doing 4 mile runs lately in my slalom boat. There are also bouys and spoil islands as well as boat tie-ups that I sprint and weave in and out of for practice. But I was wondering if you ever take your slalom boat for long-distance paddling? Thanks again for posting.

Training is training, no body have THE solution and everybody have a solution!!
All depending if you want compet or not.

To begin, enjoy a class III river on 2hours or more, and try all you can on the river, stops, surf a wave, cross a hole, etc...
That could be really good to learn how is your slalom boat.

On your slalom course, practice long ride (60 gates), go back to the top, and again...
After do some rides short 30 gates.
etc...

For your specific works, you can concentrate on your technic on 5 gates more and more hard.
You can work your speed on 5 simple gates.

You have to work on long time (aerobic) in start of season, and reduce your work time along the season and work more the specific aspect.

I think you could ask to a national slalom coach if you need.

Don't forget, slalom paddling is pretty good for creekboating, believe me!!

If you have any questions, no problem.
by

Val
valgrollemund.blogspot.com

if you want a paddle that adjustable an can do it all, you've got to buy a w1 select BLAST or an ultra with the varilock system

with the varilock system you've got infinite angle and 3cm lenght of adjustement


select-kayaks.com/en/paddles/kayak/



it's a two piece paddle and it's easy to carry and stiff, you won't feel it's a two piece

it maybe more expensive but it will fit you has you progress and found your personnal feather angle



corran told me one day, the ferrari worth nothing of you put an old motor in it

ferrari = kayak
motor = paddle

Hi...

If your still looking, try Mitchell Blades, they're uk based, and well worth a call or email, the owner is really helpful, and will steer you right I'm sure 'pardon the pun'....

Great looking and fully bespoke...


Good luck!

the blast slalom is really a nice paddle

www.kayakimport.ca/index.php?page=shop.p..._virtuemart&Itemid=3


the blade are in front of your hand, you got more reach, more power

TBudd wrote:

That's excellent information, Val! Thanks so much. Now I know my Shred has been close to the right size but I get why the narrower blade of the Splat seemed good (though the shaft is too long). I will be getting whatever 196cm paddle with a 30 degree feather. Am looking over all the websites now and will get going on purchasing one pretty quick here.

What length/angle is your current paddle (the Splat you mentioned?) Because if it is a composite paddle you can easily adjust it yourself (or have a handy paddling pal do this for you). Not that you should not buy a paddle but it will allow you to get some more experience before you spend a few hunderd dollars on a set of blades.

Use heat glue to reattach your blade so you can play around with the angle. To me 30 degrees is not a good angle for sprinting, you need a bigger one to use your torso rotation (remember, your body muscles are a lot bigger than your arms!) more effectively. Slalom is in effect a type of sprinting, albeit on white water.

Cheers,

MIchiel

What is a good angle for sprinting, michielv, per your preference? My other blades are all 30 degree feathers. Some really helpful info here. Unfortunately I don't know my way around a screw driver much less a welding torch! To anyone who knows me I am going to sound inconsistent here (because I always espouse spending for good equipment and the right equipment for the job (why I have a large quiver of boats)) but wow--highest end paddle costing $500! Yow! It almost makes me want to start another post with the theme, "If you were careening towards jagged rocks and you knew you could only save one thing--after your skin--what would it be, your paddle or your boat?!"

I am going to spend $300 I can see, but if that get's me a good paddle it'll be worth it. I just have to make sure I can get it here in Florida USA. We don't get white water here in Florida (though we do get washing machine conditions when the wind blows) so a lot of my slalom paddling will be flat water sprinting and gate maneuvering.

And I really appreciate all the help, folks. Thank you.

Some more options: www.epickayaks.com/shop/store/paddles/mid-wing

If you are mostly doing flatwater racing, probably look at wing paddles. Their cheapest mid-wing is $340, but is only 28 oz, which is 8.25 oz. less than your Splat.

Use Lettmann Ergo's very expensive but worth every penny, use them for all paddling now from squirt to river to slalom, not cheap but awesome awesome blades. Completly solid no stroke wasted.

www.lettmann.de/catalog/product_info.php...3_50/products_id/129

TBudd wrote:

What is a good angle for sprinting, michielv, per your preference? My other blades are all 30 degree feathers. Some really helpful info here. Unfortunately I don't know my way around a screw driver much less a welding torch! To anyone who knows me I am going to sound inconsistent here (because I always espouse spending for good equipment and the right equipment for the job (why I have a large quiver of boats)) but wow--highest end paddle costing $500! Yow! It almost makes me want to start another post with the theme, "If you were careening towards jagged rocks and you knew you could only save one thing--after your skin--what would it be, your paddle or your boat?!"

I am going to spend $300 I can see, but if that get's me a good paddle it'll be worth it. I just have to make sure I can get it here in Florida USA. We don't get white water here in Florida (though we do get washing machine conditions when the wind blows) so a lot of my slalom paddling will be flat water sprinting and gate maneuvering.

And I really appreciate all the help, folks. Thank you.

I paddle a lot of flatwater too (actually, 99.99% of my paddling is on flatwater) and I like the 75 degrees feather a lot. That said, I paddle sprint K1's with a wing paddle in a flatwater sprint style (arms up high, lots of body rotation etc.) but in my past I played a lot of canoepolo with various incarnations of the Polo Kinetic (brands: DD, Mega) and this is probably similar to the type of training you will do in your slalom boat.

The best thing for you would probably be an adjustable shaft that lets you adjust length and feather. Lendal makes (used to make?) a really good type of split/adjustable shaft and if you can get hold of one, get it. Couple that shaft with a set of Kinetic blades and Bob's your uncle. The Kinetic is a really nice, powerful blade with lots of catch, good steering properties and not overly big so easy on your shoulders and elbows. Personally I feel the whole ergo-shaft business is highly overrated and will not work properly with an adjustable shaft.

Assembling a paddle is not that hard, it's almost as simple as putting together an Ikea Billy bookshelf . BTW: most slalom paddlers train on flatwater too, lots of it. I've seen groups of paddlers train on a small piece of flatwater near the Argentiere (France) slalom course to get the movements right and only then go out to do some "real" slalom paddling.

Cheers,

Michiel

PS if you need help on assembling/modifying paddles, just let me know and I'll do my best to help you out. A couple of pictures can do wonders.

Nice paddle the Lettman but I'm almost certain I can't get that here in the States. Hmmm.

michielv,

REALLY helpful info there. See, like yourself most of my conditioning training will be on the flats (going out this morning for a 2 hour session for sure). I'm training for a 12 mile open-ocean race on June 20 (Kayuba Kayak against cancer) and am finding the slalom thing to be a great core work out for it (I'll be using my 17 foot sea yak for that race). With the right paddle I wonder what the possibilities of flatwater racing would be but not thinking 12 miles straight out in the ocean is the way to go at this point with a slalom boat.

But I thought I'd better get off my butt and get a good paddle here now so I ordered a Galasport Ninja Elite while I look at other options down the road, such as getting maybe one of the other paddles talked about in this thread (research a way of getting them here). I've learned a lot from this thread, so thanks everyone!

Nice paddle the Lettman but I'm almost certain I can't get that here in the States. Hmmm.

They come in two halfs, you can always get em shippied over, cut to length, glue job done..

@TBudd: contgrats on your new paddle!

Man, I wish you were living overhere or I saw these ads just a bit earlier. There are some almost brandnew DD paddles (one straight shaft slalom and a crankshaft freestyle/slalom) for sale overhere. Prices are 100 euro and 75 euro .. I could have cut those in half and send them over to you for something like 15 euro shipping. Get yourself some epoxy glue (less than 10 dollars) and you'd have a great carbon paddle for less than 150 dollars..

I am not the seller but I would have helped you out by making you a custom dowel to connect the two paddle halves (done that a lot of times and they work great) for free (like I said, I do this often and have everything lying around in my garage. It's fun to tinker with gear )

Have a look at these: link.marktplaats.nl/255024213 and link.marktplaats.nl/255022329.

If you're interested, let me know if I need to help out on this one.

michielv and Val,

Just curious. What's the longest distance you've paddled a slalom boat (such as outside a slalom course)? How far have you done in your boats? (*I'm pushing mine to it's limits and was really interested in what you've found as practical with this hull type.) If you've never measured this no worries.